Player Shop Updates Start Monday | The GemStoneIV TownCrier

>Any chance permits and shops can be made nontransferable to prevent folk from squatting and snatching them up just to resell for millions over on PC? This was a huge problem in the past…. with the MAing and scripts that some were using, it made it next to impossible for someone that legitimately wanted a shop to get one.

+1 to this!

~Land Pirate Maylan~

Out of curiosity….What happens to those shops that are evicted and any possible merchandise they hold? Is it held indefinitely for a possible owner return? Does it go out to local pawn shops? Is it just scooped up and given to the janitor?

>Any chance permits and shops can be made nontransferable to prevent folk from squatting and snatching them up just to resell for millions over on PC? This was a huge problem in the past…. with the MAing and scripts that some were using, it made it next to impossible for someone that legitimately wanted a shop to get one.

As for a release of permits, perhaps limit them to 1 a day per paying account (I’m guessing F2P can’t own a shop on their own). This’ll should help prevent a mass collection of permits and shop claims by any single person (granted some people do have multiple pay accounts).

It’s already been said there would be no limit to how many shops an account can have, but maybe a restriction from grabbing multiple permits a day will help make it easier for a lot more people to obtain one in game and not through other venues, such as the PC.

Just an idea.

-Drumpel

>>(I’m guessing F2P can’t own a shop on their own).

I thought that you had to be premium to own a shop, but… maybe that was just a 3 room shop. Been a long time since it was a real question, since shops were pretty much unavailable.

As far as rent goes, will partners be able to also contribute to rent or view how much is available toward that? It would be nice to have some separate, dedicated rent ‘account’ in the shop, if possible.

>There won’t be a shortage of shops, so don’t panic. There are 679 shops and of which 462 are abandoned with my latest test from prime.

Sounds like plenty of you’ve got some way of restricting it to 1 per player and shift them to the towns where the demand is, but not nearly enough if you haven’t and allow a couple of players to scoop all the prime town vacancies.

>> I thought that you had to be premium to own a shop, but… maybe that was just a 3 room shop. Been a long time since it was a real question, since shops were pretty much unavailable.

The normal/premium is the 1/3 room distinction.

I think it goes without saying that F2P won’t be allowed, but a GM should confirm it. However, I’d be amazed.

+1 on some mechanism to prevent them from being gobbled up and scalped. I don’t have problems with people having more than 1, but they should be actively used, not just flipped for profit, so transfer difficulties should be part of t.

Let’s make it an RP event, and the Mayor now needs to nominate a Commissioner of trade, who has two vice-deputies. They then need clerical and support staff to process the transfer, and so buying a shop is tied up in 3-6 months of red tape.

So its at 1300% now? 🙂

Can you please limit shops to 1 per account to prevent profiteering or we’re right back to square one again. I remember have 2 on one account when they first came out which at the time I felt guilty about because there were people around that ended up having to pay 5 million for one which is alot compared to the 100k permit. Landing shops were floating for 40 million before this fix, can imagine if people with 10+ characters on one account end up with 10+ shops on a single account?

I don’t want shops non-transferable, but I would like to see the initial release of permits to be 1 per account.

I don’t think it’s been addressed since it’s not on the F2P wiki page and I’ve kept that current, but I presume that F2P accounts cannot own playershops?

And I would not be averse to having Shops with mechanics similar to Premium Homes: certain rights transfer across the account (like maybe “restocking goods” and “withdrawing silver”, for example)…

Just want to echo what others have said about limiting shop purchases somehow.

And I’ll also add that it’s not only about people buying shops and flipping them, but also that shops are valuable as an alternate form of locker space since people can put things in at prices nobody would ever pay.

I would also be in favor of one shop/account! If it looks like the shops just aren’t in that high of a demand at that rate, then it seems reasonable to begin expanding that to 2/account or 3/account for those extra adventurous types.

– Overlord EK

>You now regard Eorgina with a warm demeanor.

I would rather that it be expanded down the subscription tier (available to F2P) before expanding the depth of ownership (multiples per account).

1/ F2P
2/ standard
3/ Premium
4/ Platinum

“Krakii’s Kharam-Dzu Konsortium”, with franchise branches now open in Solhaven, the Landing, and Icemule Trace!
Nnnnt! No Icemule Trace, I’m only Premium…

I like the idea of one per account, at least to start (and I already have a shop, so nothing would change for me). If there are still a lot available after a bit, then perhaps more could be allowed per account from the new purchasing.

Multiple city shops for the same character would be neat, but the citizenship requirement would kind of stop that.

_ _ _
Wyrom gestures at you, causing you to explode.

I’m not sure if the code would support it, but the need to have multiple shops strictly for inventory reasons could be fixed by allowing more tables, counters, etc. in a room, or more slots available on them, or more rooms in a shop. These could be SimuCoin add-ons. This wouldn’t solve the need to have a shop in the Landing and another in Vaalor and another in the Rest, but you can still own a shop and be a partner in others, right?

F2P shouldn’t be allowed to own a shop, because it can serve as a locker for them, and they have to pay Simucoins to have a locker.

As far as upgrades go:
– Limit of 1 shop per account (This will help to ensure shops are available to all)
– The 3% fee for selling an item is paid up front when the object is listed (This will discourage listing items for storage/display)

>> As far as upgrades go:

>> – Limit of 1 shop per account (This will help to ensure shops are available to all)

I’d be fine with 1 per character… I think 1 per account is overly restrictive.

>> – The 3% fee for selling an item is paid up front when the object is listed (This will discourage listing items for storage/display)

This is a terrible idea. How do you handle items that don’t sell and / or get repriced? I’d prefer to see a scaling monthly fee that decreased based on sales volume (so a shop that sell nothing pays a higher max fee which can be reduced based on sales during the month).

— Robert

It’s their shop, let them use it as a locker or display if the want. This harms no one.

F2P having shops would be horrible and out of line with F2P intention.

if a real account wants a locker, thats their vall, but not F2P.

>I’d be fine with 1 per character… I think 1 per account is overly restrictive.

that’s how it is now, and in the past it was a major problem. So people are suggesting 1 per account to start, and then make them more available as demand is truly determined, not an assumption that, “There won’t be a shortage of shops… There are 679 shops and of which 462 are abandoned with my latest test from prime.”

yeah, i think slowly relaxing restrictions is good. OR plan to add more if they sell out, dynamically devalueing poachers.

>>I’d be fine with 1 per character… I think 1 per account is overly restrictive.

1 per character is essentially no limit at all. I would prefer if shop ownership was available to a large amount of individuals. Allowing one person to monopolize shops should be discouraged so that their primary purpose, selling things, is the focus instead of extra storage.

>>This is a terrible idea. How do you handle items that don’t sell and / or get repriced? I’d prefer to see a scaling monthly fee that decreased based on sales volume (so a shop that sell nothing pays a higher max fee which can be reduced based on sales during the month).

If the item doesn’t sell, then you’ll eat the cost. Perhaps you will rethink listing items not worth selling, or you’ll learn how to price things correctly so they do sell. There are many many items listed that are overpriced, they will sit there for eternity because there is no cost associated with listing items. The shop becomes stagnant, and basically unused, taking away an opportunity for someone who might put more thought into its use.

If you want to reprice the item, you should have to pay the 3% fee again. This will remind you again, that you should do some research before you list an item to ensure you’re asking a reasonable price. If you’re not willing to make an effort, you shouldn’t be rewarded.

Shops should require an adequate amount of silvers to maintain them.
The monthly fee seems to be nothing more than a way to evict non-active characters.

>>It’s their shop, let them use it as a locker or display if the want. This harms no one.

We can agree to disagree. Having a shop used as a locker or display removes the opportunity to have an active shop that is being used for it’s intended purpose.

What happens when everyone uses a shop as a locker or a display?

>> What happens when everyone uses a shop as a locker or a display?

Then my shop will be very popular and sales will rise.

Seriously, shops have never not been available, they’ve just been VERY expensive to buy. Also, I’ve never really had a challenge finding something when I went looking for it in the playershops (reasonable things) for it. It sounds like it will be much cheaper to get into a shop going forward, which is a good thing. Penalizing people for running a shop just doesn’t make good sense.

— Robert

>>Penalizing people for running a shop just doesn’t make good sense.

It makes sense to me if you want to discourage people from using shops in a way they weren’t intended to be used.
I don’t recall adding 75 additional locker spaces for each character on your premium account as the purpose of a shop.

In my opinion, running a shop should take a little more effort than, oh I have this 4x runestaff, let me list it for 500k. You should research what something is worth, and price is appropriately. If you want to list items that are never going to sell, because you don’t put thought or effort into it, then it should cost you. You’ll learn to price things better going forward, I wouldn’t consider an education a penalty, I would consider it a good investment.

> In my opinion, running a shop should take a little more effort than, oh I have this 4x runestaff, let me list it for 500k.

In counter to this, I have a partnership in a friend’s shop. And I will sometimes price something over its value just to start as I then figure out prices because I’m not a bard and I don’t want to lose the loresong and have to then get it re-sung, which can’t be done while it’s on a surface.

I am fine with the idea of limiting to one shop per account, especially at first, but I wouldn’t be thrilled to see an upfront cost per item.

>> In my opinion, running a shop should take a little more effort than, oh I have this 4x runestaff, let me list it for 500k. You should research what something is worth, and price is appropriately. If you want to list items that are never going to sell, because you don’t put thought or effort into it, then it should cost you. You’ll learn to price things better going forward, I wouldn’t consider an education a penalty, I would consider it a good investment.

You are making a lot of (incorrect) assumptions about how some folks run their shops.

I think a shop should take as much (or as little) effort as the shop owner wants to put into it. You are welcome to run your shop the way you see fit.

If you are so concerned about locker shops then why not just require a minimum amount of sales per month to retain the shop? I’d much prefer that then being hit with a penalty every time I want to make an adjustment to prices in my shop. And this may surprise you but… sometimes I want to raise the prices on items because they are selling too fast (I actually try to always keep stock on the shelf for certain items and price helps adjust the rate of sales). I don’t want to pay a penalty every time I want to actively manage my shop to adjust stock to current demand.

When selling items for millions (or tens of millions), a 3% penalty to adjust the price is just crazy (e.g. 450k to adjust the price on an item for 15 million silver). Likewise when adjusting a stack of 50 items the penalty for adjusting the price could be fairly costly as well.

Stop looking for ways to penalize people that actually enjoy and want to sell things (and assuming that everyone who wants to adjust prices doesn’t have a clue about what they are selling is worth).

— Robert

>>In counter to this, I have a partnership in a friend’s shop. And I will sometimes price something over its value just to start as I then figure out prices because I’m not a bard and I don’t want to lose the loresong and have to then get it re-sung, which can’t be done while it’s on a surface.

The suggestion could be tweaked to better support this situation. If you’re lowering the price during the adjustment, you aren’t charged anything more. If you raise the price during the adjustment, you are charged 3% of the price increase.

>>I think a shop should take as much (or as little) effort as the shop owner wants to put into it. You are welcome to run your shop the way you see fit.

Nothing I have suggested prevents you from putting little to no effort into your shop. You are still welcome to run your shop the way you see fit.

>>If you are so concerned about locker shops then why not just require a minimum amount of sales per month to retain the shop? I’d much prefer that then being hit with a penalty every time I want to make an adjustment to prices in my shop.

A minimum amount of sales wouldn’t be adequate, I could easily list 25 items for 1 silver and have an alt purchase them. If you’re not talking about quantity, and instead value, it most likely wouldn’t work because a low value would be set to allow for your “every day” player to maintain their shop, and it would be pointless. Say the value is 100k. I price one item at 150k, buy it with an alt to maintain my shop, and eat a 3% fee (4500 silvers). I’m using my silvers to buy my own item, and those silvers go back into my shop balance, so I only lose 4500.

>>And this may surprise you but… sometimes I want to raise the prices on items because they are selling too fast (I actually try to always keep stock on the shelf for certain items and price helps adjust the rate of sales). I don’t want to pay a penalty every time I want to actively manage my shop to adjust stock to current demand.

The 3% fee is already there. It’s not an additional penalty in any way. There is no change in the cost to you, only when that cost is applied.

It will also ensure that items aren’t pulled from shops to sell in person to avoid the 3% surcharge.

>>When selling items for millions (or tens of millions), a 3% penalty to adjust the price is just crazy (e.g. 450k to adjust the price on an item for 15 million silver). Likewise when adjusting a stack of 50 items the penalty for adjusting the price could be fairly costly as well.

I’m not sure you understand how your shop works with this kind of statement. There is no penalty. There is a 3% fee when an item is sold.

I’m against changing the system for how shops behave *once players have acquired them* at least for now.

What I am most worried about is just abuse of the system to acquire shops. That’s the abuse I care about most.

>> I’m not sure you understand how your shop works with this kind of statement. There is no penalty. There is a 3% fee when an item is sold.

The earlier suggestion put forth was to apply the 3% fee when the item was listed and then re-apply the 3% fee every time a price was adjusted.

If you aren’t going to apply a fee for adjusting prices (down) then you would still need to account for adjusting prices (up). If you are suggesting that I only ever pay 3% on the sale of the item based on the highest price that I list it at then I am not nearly as opposed to the idea.

>> If you’re not talking about quantity, and instead value, it most likely wouldn’t work because a low value would be set to allow for your “every day” player to maintain their shop, and it would be pointless.

I was definitely suggesting total silver amount vs. volume / count of sales.

The up front proposal also penalizes folks that like to change out what they offer month over month. My wife likes to sell clothing and containers in her shop. She puts a bunch of stuff out that she packed away from a few years back and sees what sells. A month or two later, she swaps it out again. Charging a fee up front would likely result in less stock rotation / more static inventory being left in the shop – the opposite of what you are trying to achieve for actively managed shops.

So back to my original statement – let shop owners do what they want with their shops – feel free to open your own shop and do what you want with it – you’ve always had that option available to you, it’s just been pricey in the past and should be much cheaper going forward.

>> Nothing I have suggested prevents you from putting little to no effort into your shop. You are still welcome to run your shop the way you see fit.

In my opinion, running a shop should take a little more effort than, oh I have this 4x runestaff, let me list it for 500k. You should research what something is worth, and price is appropriately. If you want to list items that are never going to sell, because you don’t put thought or effort into it, then it should cost you. — Veythorne

— Robert

<< The playershop system evaluates if the owner or a partner has entered the threshold within the last 90 days. You can check in by entering the shop and entering the SHOP command. After 90 days, your shop will be evicted. >>

Do you just need to (a) just cross the threshold or (b) both cross the threshold and type SHOP?

Retser, you are WAY late for April Fool’s, dude.

Next you’re gonna tell us there is a horse here to mount, and smooth stones sing song of luck when rubbed.

Player shop overhaul! That’s rich!

>Once all the evicted shops have been handled I will slowly start opening permit sales in all the realms. This will allow players to visit the local shop warehouse, buy a permit, and CLAIM a shop. The method of release is under discussion, but there will most likely be more than enough shops to just open it up and let those who want one, buy one.

It sounds like everyone agrees that limiting shops to one per account, at least until after some initial wave of purchases, is the right path. The only people I can see disagreeing with this are those that already own a shop and want to capitalize on several more.

I would also welcome a permanent one shop per account limit, but then perhaps allow all characters from that account to access the shop. There’s no reason someone should have two or more shops if there exists someone without a shop who wants one.

<smooth stones sing song of luck when rubbed.

everyone knows that they increase your experience absorption rate.

http://i.imgur.com/lsWPzG9.gif