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GM Finros posts first lumnis contest results

GM Finros posts the results from the new Lumnis Contest after the first cycle ended. Read all about it in message 186:

http://bit.ly/2h4QN6y

Category: Game Design Discussions
Topic: General Discussion about Gemstone IV

Date: 11/28/2016 09:14 PM CST
From: TWOLOW4ZERO
Subj: Re: Updates to the Experience System!
I conur!


Date: 11/28/2016 11:21 PM CST
From: VICIMER
Subj: Re: Updates to the Experience System!
There still seems to be characters who can’t get the boost to drop. Different characters, creatures, locations. ASSIST?


Date: 11/28/2016 11:24 PM CST
From: LADYFLEUR
Subj: Re: Updates to the Experience System!
No complaints about this at all, but I noticed the day 15 boost increased from 3 to 5. Is this intentional?

Also, something still seems buggy with LTE and offline absorption. I had turned offline absorption off for Lumnis and turned it back on after, and I used some of my LTE boosts afterwards. When I logged out and back in, my LTE pool was empty and I had also absorbed an extra 71 experience even though 10 minutes had not yet passed. I logged off and back in again and immediately absorbed another 72 experience though 10 minutes had not passed. So the flag may have reverted to the original bug with the LTE pool.


Date: 11/29/2016 12:08 AM CST
From: GS4-COASE
Subj: Re: Updates to the Experience System!
>There still seems to be characters who can’t get the boost to drop. Different characters, creatures, locations. ASSIST?

They can ASSIST to record any details, but it would be better to either post or email me at my play.net address the following:

-Character Name
-Character Level
-Creatures hunted
-Number of creatures killed (for each different creature type)
-Method of hunting primarily used (spell number or type of physical attack used)
-Subscription status (Paid / F2P)

Coase


Date: 11/29/2016 01:13 AM CST
From: GS4-COASE
Subj: Re: Updates to the Experience System!
>No complaints about this at all, but I noticed the day 15 boost increased from 3 to 5. Is this intentional?

Are you referencing the day 15 Login Reward for bounty boosts? They’ve always been 5 for paid subscribers (there was a typo in the original announcement, it appears).

>Also, something still seems buggy with LTE and offline absorption. I had turned offline absorption off for Lumnis and turned it back on after, and I used some of my LTE boosts afterwards. When I logged out and back in, my LTE pool was empty and I had also absorbed an extra 71 experience even though 10 minutes had not yet passed. I logged off and back in again and immediately absorbed another 72 experience though 10 minutes had not passed. So the flag may have reverted to the original bug with the LTE pool.

What was the character name and (approximate) time that this occurred?

Coase


Date: 11/29/2016 01:21 AM CST
From: LADYFLEUR
Subj: Re: Updates to the Experience System!
>Are you referencing the day 15 Login Reward for bounty boosts? They’ve always been 5 for paid subscribers (there was a typo in the original announcement, it appears).

Yes, I guess I always went by the announcement instead of paying closer attention on the specific day. Good to know, thanks.


Date: 11/29/2016 04:17 AM CST
From: GS4-COASE
Subj: Re: Updates to the Experience System!
>Also, something still seems buggy with LTE and offline absorption. I had turned offline absorption off for Lumnis and turned it back on after, and I used some of my LTE boosts afterwards. When I logged out and back in, my LTE pool was empty and I had also absorbed an extra 71 experience even though 10 minutes had not yet passed. I logged off and back in again and immediately absorbed another 72 experience though 10 minutes had not passed. So the flag may have reverted to the original bug with the LTE pool.

After further investigation, what was happening is that if you missed a long-term exp pulse due to having no long-term exp at the time, the system failed to record you as being present for that pulse, so it kept trying to give the pulse to you until you added some long-term exp. Sadly, it wasn’t intentional to save pulses like that, so that has been fixed.

Coase


Date: 11/29/2016 10:45 AM CST
From: LADYFLEUR
Subj: Re: Updates to the Experience System!
I figured that’s what was happening. Thanks for the update.


Date: 11/29/2016 04:40 PM CST
From: CAPTAINREDBEARD
Subj: Re: Updates to the Experience System!

Did we consider as an alternative to the crippled clumsy lumnis contest system, LUMNIS MODE OLD/NEW. Let players choose which mode they want. NEW mode gives the 18k or whatever you found the average to be. OLD mode lets min/maxers battle for more.


Date: 11/29/2016 04:42 PM CST
From: VANKRASN39
Subj: Re: Updates to the Experience System!

>Did we consider as an alternative to the crippled clumsy lumnis contest system, LUMNIS MODE OLD/NEW. Let players choose which mode they want. NEW mode gives the 18k or whatever you found the average to be. OLD mode lets min/maxers battle for more.

how would you even know how to describe the contest when the first one isn’t over yet?


Date: 11/29/2016 08:56 PM CST
From: CATIPILL2
Subj: Re: Updates to the Experience System!
so does this make all logic enhanceives that make ya bonus post 100 like say 140(50) which seems the max is now pointless ? since it will be pool based ? or will they defy laws of time and have Lumnis end faster then 6 hours?


Date: 11/30/2016 05:56 AM CST
From: RATHBONER
Subj: Re: Updates to the Experience System!
>so does this make all logic enhanceives that make ya bonus post 100 like say 140(50) which seems the max is now pointless ? since it will be pool based ? or will they defy laws of time and have Lumnis end faster then 6 hours?

If your normal pool was greater than the standardised one (at most 20 people will be in this situation) Lumnis will go faster for you than it used to. If your normal pool was fairly close to the standardised one and you don’t run through it in one session, it still may go faster for you. Unless it flukes out at exactly the same, for everyone else it will last longer than 6 hours.

If you use LOG enhancives it will go faster than if you don’t. This has advantages, which probably aren’t worth as much as they used to be, so I expect LOG enhancives will be used a bit less than they used to be. They don’t become pointless due to Lumnis changes (though the offline changes do make them pointless in some situations) but the cost/benefit balance does shift.


Date: 11/30/2016 08:44 AM CST
From: KRAKII
Subj: Re: Updates to the Experience System!
And the point that I keep reiterating: if you have enough login time to actually absorb everything each week under the new system, you can take off your LOGic enhancives for the remaining 83 days in the cycle and use NO charges/save the cost of recharging them.
With the new point-based system, if you get it all, you get it all. <shrug>


Date: 12/01/2016 10:20 AM CST
From: SYNNERA3
Subj: Re: Updates to the Experience System!
Can we get a sneak peek at top 10 and how much exp they earned? The suspense is killing me.


Date: 12/01/2016 10:52 AM CST
From: KRAKII
Subj: Re: Updates to the Experience System!
“…at the top 10 so far and…” — Synnera3

Fixed that up for you.

(The only character I’m actually playing seriously, Lumnis starts this afternoon [because last week I was home, and could login during daylight] but I can’t possibly gain any experience until ~6+ hours later, when I get home from my Boy Scout meeting.)

I certainly don’t anticipate being anywhere near the top 50.

But only about half of peoples’ cycles have even started, yet. (Midnight Monday morning to noon Thursday is 1/2 week, for the contest run.)


Date: 12/03/2016 11:36 AM CST
From: KRAKII
Subj: Re: Updates to the Experience System!
Coase, can you confirm/refute that rounding works with the LTE pool?

If it does NOT, then something’s buggy.

It is my belief that it DOES, because otherwise I can determine no way to absorb 32 points of experience, 3 of which are LTE.
(29 rounded is 30, which means -3 LTE from the pool, == 32 observed absorption. But 3 should only be drawn, for three sets of 10, which is 30, and I didn’t have that much absorbed, because of the 32 that went in, 3 were LTE.)

.

OR–since I just saw a pulse of 29 with only TWO (2) from LTE–I suppose it could be triggered by the changes in the tens digit of the total character experience? 3 changes, 3 from pool. 2 changes, 2 from pool.


Date: 12/03/2016 12:44 PM CST
From: OM1E5GA
Subj: Re: Updates to the Experience System!
My silvers are on a hidden d100 roll that randomly adds a single exp to the LTE absorbed just to mess with people trying to figure out the system.

Starchitin

A severed gnomish hand crawls in on its fingertips and makes a rude gesture before quickly decaying and rotting into dust. A gust of wind quickly scatters the dust.


Date: 12/03/2016 12:59 PM CST
From: KRAKII
Subj: Re: Updates to the Experience System!
Well, it’s routinely adding 3 from the LTE, even when the total absorbed is only 31 or 32. That’s what makes me think rounding is active (so >= 25/pulse would get the +3).

That one where only 2 went in, though… (it was bracketed by 3’s for several pulses) that’s the one that’s making me scratch my head.


Date: 12/04/2016 11:18 PM CST
From: LADYFLEUR
Subj: Re: Updates to the Experience System!
This contest proved exactly what I predicted and more. I won’t ever be doing this again, and yes, I’m the one who loses the most from this change. What a (non) surprise.


Date: 12/04/2016 11:31 PM CST
From: GS4-FINROS
Subj: Re: Updates to the Experience System!
The first cycle of the Lumnis contest has concluded. You can see the summary with LUMNIS CONTEST STATUS, and the list of winners with LUMNIS CONTEST WINNERS.

The final Prime contest amount is 20844. The top 11 people got 22k+, and three people got 23k+. 20844 is itself a higher amount than the top person earned in the old system on many weeks. The number one earners for the past four weeks before the contest would have placed #15, #20, #26, and #29. Of the top 40 in the previous four weeks before the contest, only two earned more than 20844, and several wouldn’t have placed in the top 50 at all.

All feedback on the contest is welcome and encouraged. I have two notes up front.

First, current contest information will be available in the future via LUMNIS CONTEST CURRENT. This was active for about the last twelve hours of this contest though I didn’t publicly note it, and will be available from the beginning in the future.

Second, a week is probably too short for the contest period. People who started their Lumnis period on Sunday afternoon, for example, may not have had time to finish. This is my fault; I originally planned to have a two-week period and somehow managed to implement it as only one week. We discussed extending the period partway through the week but decided that it might add confusion to do so. The next contest period will probably be longer to ensure that everyone gets a chance to participate.

As a final note, please remember that the switch from time-based to point-based Lumnis is based on the starting time of your last Lumnis cycle. All cycles that started before the switchover point will continue to be time-based. All cycles that start after will be point-based. That means, in a week or so, everyone will be on the point-based system.


Date: 12/05/2016 01:01 AM CST
From: GOAT
Subj: Re: Updates to the Experience System!
Two-week contest… show you’re saying I’ll be able to show up on the leaderboard twice?


Date: 12/05/2016 01:16 AM CST
From: LADYFLEUR
Subj: Re: Updates to the Experience System!
An over 5k delta shows that top 50 is too many characters. Why bother to try when any efforts will be dragged to insignificance anyway? It was definitely not worth my time or the opportunity cost.

Every 3 months is also far too often to run the contest, especially if the contest period take two weeks.


Date: 12/05/2016 06:13 AM CST
From: RATHBONER
Subj: Re: Updates to the Experience System!
>Two-week contest… show you’re saying I’ll be able to show up on the leaderboard twice?

No. I’m going to roll 17 gnomes and they’ll kick both your attempts off the top. 😉 (because if you can get two, I can schedule for 3)

>First, current contest information will be available in the future via LUMNIS CONTEST CURRENT.

The information I’d like to see is my own. At the moment its a bit coming in 2 hours down and 15776th in a marathon and only being told you finished outside the top 100 and not even getting your time. It makes it a whole lot less interesting.

I had about an hour to go when the contest ended, I’d like to know that I had 12787 from 91% (or whatever the numbers were)


Date: 12/05/2016 06:39 AM CST
From: HATESHI
Subj: Re: Updates to the Experience System!
How fun! I didn’t get a chance to participate this time due to work but am looking forward to the next contest.

– Overlord EK

>You now regard Eorgina with a warm demeanor.


Date: 12/05/2016 08:39 AM CST
From: OM1E5GA
Subj: Re: Updates to the Experience System!
<The information I’d like to see is my own. At the moment its a bit coming in 2 hours down and 15776th in a marathon and only being told you finished outside the top 100 and not even getting your time. It makes it a whole lot less interesting.>

I agree with this. It is interesting to see what others did, but it would be much more interesting if our own was included to see how we compare. Assuming we don’t get into the top 50 ourselves.

Starchitin

A severed gnomish hand crawls in on its fingertips and makes a rude gesture before quickly decaying and rotting into dust. A gust of wind quickly scatters the dust.


Date: 12/05/2016 08:55 AM CST
From: KITHUS
Subj: Re: Updates to the Experience System!
I’ll echo that I’d love to be able to see my own total.

Keith/Brinret/Shiun

Keith is correct

Wyrom, APM

http://forums.play.net/forums/GemStone%20IV/Help%20for%20Players/Policy%20Discussions/view/246


Date: 12/05/2016 09:02 AM CST
From: KARDIOS
Subj: Re: Updates to the Experience System!
It would also be helpful if there was way to see how much experience you have absorbed since your most recent Lumnis schedule began. That information could be under either (or both) LUMNIS INFO or LUMNIS CONTEST STATUS. For example, it might say something like this: “You are currently in the first of the two Lumnis tranches. You have absorbed 4321 base experience out of the 6948 base experience points available in the first tranche.” Hopefully, there’s a simpler way to say it. It might be simpler to say in my example that you have absorbed 12,963 out of 20,844 in the first tranche. Or the simplest thing might just be to say that you have absorbed 12,963 out of 34,740 for the current Lumnis week.


Date: 12/05/2016 09:03 AM CST
From: KITHUS
Subj: Re: Updates to the Experience System!
Also… Plat got 22287 so I guess if you want more Lumnis exp come to Plat?

Rank Name Exp Streak
1 Vrin 23029 0
2 Vyrshkana 22538 0
3 Issalya 22469 0
4 Sarien 22122 0
5 Omrii 21280 0

Note: Thanks for making it easy to post the results in table format. I assume that was intentional.

I feel the need to point out that Prime almost always has more than 10x the people on that Plat does so having a top 5 instead of a top 50 makes sense for us. Really it should have been like a top 3 but I’m okay with this.

Keith/Brinret/Shiun

Keith is correct

Wyrom, APM

http://forums.play.net/forums/GemStone%20IV/Help%20for%20Players/Policy%20Discussions/view/246


Date: 12/05/2016 09:08 AM CST
From: KARDIOS
Subj: Re: Updates to the Experience System!
A table would be better.

Your experience Out of
Part 1 12,693 20,844
Part 2 0 13,896
Total 12,963 34,740


Date: 12/05/2016 09:29 AM CST
From: OM1E5GA
Subj: Re: Updates to the Experience System!
<I feel the need to point out that Prime almost always has more than 10x the people on that Plat does so having a top 5 instead of a top 50 makes sense for us. Really it should have been like a top 3 but I’m okay with this.>

There must be more people in plat now then when I tried it years ago… I think I saw WHO list double digits twice and WHO FULL always fit on the screen.

Starchitin

A severed gnomish hand crawls in on its fingertips and makes a rude gesture before quickly decaying and rotting into dust. A gust of wind quickly scatters the dust.


Date: 12/05/2016 09:51 AM CST
From: KRAKII
Subj: Re: Updates to the Experience System!
Finros, is it safe to assume that if the character checking ‘lumnis contest winners’ IS one of (Anonymous) people (like #33)

.

“Why bother to try when any efforts will be dragged to insignificance anyway?” — LadyFleurs

You get to tell me to change my behavior, I get to tell you to do the same. So stop doomsaying & lighten up.

“Dragged to insignificance”? The number is 20844. You got 21930. 1086 points, that you don’t benefit from, for 12 weeks of putting out effort and spending Enhancive charges.
As previously calculated, this is the difference between sitting on a Node versus sitting on a SuperNode.
(i.e. Two [that’s 2] whopping points per pulse.)

For six hours. DAMN but that’s some exciting hunting. <yawn>

.

And quit it with the hyperbole.

“The number one earners for the past four weeks before the contest would have placed #15, #20, #26, and #29.” — Finros

You placed #12.

This means that–even if we permit the (rather arrogant) assumption of your position of supremacy, and you actually were the #1 person in ALL of the last four weeks–then,
a) you were not particularly going “all out” to maximize your gains those weeks, so
b) you gained even more this week than you usually did (YAAAY you!) for the last month, and that
c) half of the time, you would have come out ahead (the two weeks when you had no more than 20835 [would have been #26] and no more than 20534 [would have been #29], by dint of the new system.

.

“It was definitely not worth my time or the opportunity cost.” — ibid

Talk to us again after you do not “have to” use your LOGic enhancives for the next 83 days (unless your time in a calendar week is short, so you need to make certain to get it all in). 12 weeks of not having to spend Bounty points on refilling charges.

Explain to me just exactly how you calculate this ‘cost’ to you?

.

.

.

.

Unless, of course, I have completely mis-understood what you’re saying, and you placed twelfth while you were just slacking around, hardly even trying, putting forth no effort whatsoever, NOT using the Enhancives, and so on? (Which, to be honest, is what you said that you were going to do during the contest week.)

(In which case, again: you were 12th this week, and for the previous four weeks the #1 producer would have been 15, 20, 26, or 29. Which means that you–again, presupposing that it was you in each of those weeks–were REALLY not-doing-much with it in the previous four weeks.)

In which case… I have to wonder why it’s such an issue, if that performance was you taking it easy? (Since, you know: if you were taking it easy–for an entire month–then you’re not going all out, which, forgive, was the whole point behind getting all the Enhancives and boosts in the first place, right?)


Date: 12/05/2016 09:54 AM CST
From: KRAKII
Subj: Re: Updates to the Experience System!
Derp. I got so hung up on making other points, I forgot to finish my opening sentence, that I had moved from elsewhere, so I forgot about it.

“Finros, is it safe to assume that if the character checking ‘lumnis contest winners’ IS one of (Anonymous) people (like #33)” — Me

“…then that person doing the checking WILL actually see their own name in that spot?” — is how I meant to finish it.

D’oh!


Date: 12/05/2016 09:56 AM CST
From: RIKKOCHET
Subj: Re: Updates to the Experience System!
The difference in reaction to the outcome of this contest in Plat and Prime is remarkable. And somewhat amusing.

Prime:

“We didn’t earn enough so I’m not participating!” punctuated with an occasional “Can I see how I did?”

Platinum:

“I’m gonna start hoarding gems!” followed by “Let me know if you want to buy the gems I don’t need!” and “Let’s figure out who’s running Lumnis when so you can use my logic daggers of +40 awesome!” and “Are there any alchemists that can brew major logic potions? I’ve got the gems for it!” “What rank does an alchemist need to do that?” and so on.

The hyperactive sense of community in Plat helps. A lot. Our average reflects it. (Although I will admit to having had all the gems I needed on hand.)

Wee Sleepy Gnomette

Cloth-of-eonake: for when you absolutely, positively need to have zombie-impenetrable underwear. – Denil

When my scripts are acting up, I take Modrian with Coding. After a few hours, they feel like new! – MAXMANJ


Date: 12/05/2016 10:00 AM CST
From: VANKRASN39
Subj: Re: Updates to the Experience System!

>”We didn’t earn enough so I’m not participating!”

that’s a total of one person who posts 10x for every other person. not reflective of everyone at all.

>Our average reflects it.

your average reflects only 5 people having to work together. Not exactly hard.


Date: 12/05/2016 10:08 AM CST
From: DERPALLARDIE
Subj: Re: Updates to the Experience System!

Apparently you don’t know those 5 people!


Date: 12/05/2016 10:10 AM CST
From: XANTHE
Subj: Re: Updates to the Experience System!

The attitude encompasses all of Platinum. Assuming that we only have 5 people who actually TRY is a little assumptive yourself. I don’t mean to troll. I believe that the IDEA being represented is that in Platinum, we want to maximize the returns for everyone through cooperation, rather than selfishly taking the millennialist attitude of “what’s in it for me”.


Date: 12/05/2016 10:11 AM CST
From: VANKRASN39
Subj: Re: Updates to the Experience System!

>Assuming that we only have 5 people who actually TRY is a little assumptive yourself.

you only needed 5 people for the top, that’s what the 5 people referred to. But oh yeah, you had 30 people on for EG!

>rather than selfishly taking the millennialist attitude of “what’s in it for me”.

lol wut?


Date: 12/05/2016 10:17 AM CST
From: XANTHE
Subj: Re: Updates to the Experience System!
I give up, you all win. The points attempted to be made by the Platinum group are obviously wasted on the ignorant. Enjoy Prime and thank you for the reminder of why I don’t play on that server. Have a wonderful life 😀


Date: 12/05/2016 10:21 AM CST
From: RIKKOCHET
Subj: Re: Updates to the Experience System!
VANKRSN39:

And you have proved my point in rather spectacular fashion.

Thanks and have a wonderful day.

Cloth-of-eonake: for when you absolutely, positively need to have zombie-impenetrable underwear. – Denil

When my scripts are acting up, I take Modrian with Coding. After a few hours, they feel like new! – MAXMANJ


Date: 12/05/2016 10:27 AM CST
From: VANKRASN39
Subj: Re: Updates to the Experience System!

what are you guys even talking about? You’re so weird over such a small amount of xp. The top 5 for prime did better than plat if you want to compare apples to apples.

 

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